Rio Grande Boxcar with reduced size flanges

chrishappe
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Rio Grande Boxcar with reduced size flanges

Post by chrishappe » Tue Jan 19, 2010 9:49 pm

DSCF2610-1.jpg
Gold Coast Rio Grande Boxcar with the flanges turned down a little. Code 55 rail.

ctxmf74
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Re: Rio Grande Boxcar with reduced size flanges

Post by ctxmf74 » Tue Jan 19, 2010 11:19 pm

Hi Chris, This looks like a solution to the problem of running gold coast cars on track with smaller flangeways? Were you able to turn the flanges down with the insulated bushings in place? I was wondering if they can stand the strain of the cutting operation's torque? ....dave

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Marquette
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Re: Rio Grande Boxcar with reduced size flanges

Post by Marquette » Tue Jan 19, 2010 11:54 pm

This interests me as well.

Though of course my final goal is to use P:87 wheels so I'll probably have to get axles made too...
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Re: Rio Grande Boxcar with reduced size flanges

Post by ctxmf74 » Wed Jan 20, 2010 12:38 am

TTQuebec wrote:This interests me as well.

Though of course my final goal is to use P:87 wheels so I'll probably have to get axles made too...
If they make an HO P87 wheel in a size the equates to a TT scale freight wheel diameter you should be able to get them to mount them on TT gauge axels. The will be a set up fee so the more you order the better. P87 wheels are a bit narrower than HP wheels and have slightly smaller flanges so they should look good......dave

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Re: Rio Grande Boxcar with reduced size flanges

Post by Marquette » Wed Jan 20, 2010 2:36 am

They do - the 24" HO wheel is almost exactly 33" in TT, and the 26" HO wheel is almost exactly 36" in TT.

I've sent an email to NWSL asking about pricing. Once I get a response, or even now, I'll ask the question here on the board, if anyone else might be interested, so as to reduce costs for ourselves.
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CSD
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Re: Rio Grande Boxcar with reduced size flanges

Post by CSD » Thu Jan 21, 2010 12:43 am

Folks,

Seeing as this topic is not about an off the shelf item in the library format, I've moved it to the Prototypes/Model forum for futher disscussion.

-Mark
Mark
//S

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Re: Rio Grande Boxcar with reduced size flanges

Post by Marquette » Thu Jan 21, 2010 1:06 am

scaro wrote:I would be interested to hear how you go with NWSL. I suggest you might try 3SMR for axles as I think they do varying lengths.
The quote I asked them for was the HO 24" wheels mounted on pointed-tip axles, axles of a length to fit the Gold Coast trucks. If the price is reasonable enough, I'm willing to pay a little more to save on the time and trouble of mounting and gauging the wheels myself.
The tantalising thing is that if your 'TT' gets slightly bigger, you can use the 8mm wheels done for 3mm in the UK by the likes of Ian Osborne and others, which are not only finescale, but cheap as chips.
This may sound somewhat ironic...

...but there's too much available in N. Am. proto TT in 1:120 for me to consider changing the scale.
Ian stocks a 7mm TT wheel but it is not finescale, though the flange is quite fine. I think this was a run organised by the late John Fisher.
Ben
The 8mm wheel works out to 37.8" (TT scale inches), so a bit big for N. Am. freight or pax cars in 1:120; the 7mm would be almost exact for a 33" wheel. So that could be a useful thing.

NWSL also has other specifications besides P:87 for the 24" and 26" HO wheels (33" and 36" respectively in TT), so it's very possible that they have a profile that will work with standard TT track. However, this isn't something I've looked into, as I would like to get as close as possible to Proto:120.

EDIT: Also, Ben: I took the calipers to the GC truck, and the wheelbase is almost bang-on 5'6".
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Re: Rio Grande Boxcar with reduced size flanges

Post by ctxmf74 » Thu Jan 21, 2010 12:03 pm

TTQuebec wrote: NWSL also has other specifications besides P:87 for the 24" and 26" HO wheels (33" and 36" respectively in TT), so it's very possible that they have a profile that will work with standard TT track. However, this isn't something I've looked into, as I would like to get as close as possible to Proto:120.
Before getting too far toward P120 wheels I'd suggest you do some testing. I model in all scales so have tried the various wheel standards and have found that a flange about .020 works the best no matter what scale car it is on. Thus P48 with it's .023 flanges works great, P64 with .019 is still ok but P87 with .013 is too touchy. The smaller P87 flanges look good especially in photographs but the trade off is a lot more effort to put the cars on the track, to not knock them off during routine coupling , etc. The track and trucks also have to be built and maintained to a lot more time consuming standards.
If the layout is simple with nice straight and level track, wide curves and large numbered switch frogs it will be easier to keep small flanges on the rails but if it's the typical compromised model scene with tight curves and less than perfect track work the smaller flanges will make operations a lot more work. I'm planning an HO layout now and just did a lot of testing with P87 wheels and sergent couplers and finally decided to go with code 88 wheels and KD "scale" couplers after playing with the stuff for a few hours.
It is interesting to me that HP went with flanges about .022 high way back in the old days when a lot of models had very large flanges, too bad the Europeans didn't pick up on this as they developed their TT lines........dave

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Re: Rio Grande Boxcar with reduced size flanges

Post by chrishappe » Tue Jan 26, 2010 11:59 pm

A bit late with my replies but here goes. I turned the flanges down on the axles just as they come, but I don't cut them down I file them. You can use a lathe, but quicker is to just chuck them in a cordless drill and file them down with a small needle file. Chuck one wheel and file the other one. Just don't put too much load on it when you are filing. Gently works best. Also be careful doing this, it is best to run the drill in reverse and hold the file so that if it snags in the chuck it throws it away from you, not at your chest.

I have also been experimenting with HP wheels in Gold Coast trucks. They look pretty good but the problem is Gold Coast use pointed axles and HP use blunt axles. Two choices are to make or buy new pointy axles which is not easy, or drill out the side frames to accept the blunt axles. This works but they don't roll quite as freely as the originals do.

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Re: Rio Grande Boxcar with reduced size flanges

Post by ConducTTor » Wed Jan 27, 2010 12:28 am

chrishappe wrote:just chuck them in a cordless drill and file them down with a small needle file. Chuck one wheel and file the other one.
Heeeeeeeeyyyyyy! That's great - thanks for the idea!
:wave:

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