TT Trackwork

TT Trackwork

Postby richardedmonds » Tue Oct 21, 2014 3:36 pm

I have started this topic to get others opinions and knowledge of trackwork in general and to what is best to use for myself. After recent chats etc I find myself veering away from my normal " that will do nicely because its close enough" over to Marquettes and Ben's stance on a more finer scale approach to things. I think really it was marquette talking about Proto TT that shoved me over the hill but since then I've been thinking that we all really want the best and as close to real scale as we can so lets chat about it

Ok i will start with this one --- has anybody tried fitting finer rail into available sleeper or tie bases such as Tillig or Keuhn and if so what did you find the problems were
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Re: TT Trackwork

Postby krokodil » Tue Oct 21, 2014 3:56 pm

The Kuehn itself is already quite critical with its rail height of about 1.7 mm. Only the newest rolling stock works well on this track. To reduce the rail height will require finer wheels on every vehicle. Into Tillig sleepers we pulled already different rails - the critical is the footsize of the rail material. We experimented with Code55 rails but the original fittings were to hight so finally we glued the rails to the flat sleepers.
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Re: TT Trackwork

Postby Tom Dempsey » Tue Oct 21, 2014 4:22 pm

You will need to gauge the track just as if handlaying (which you essentially are) as not all track bases are the same. In the past, the go to glue was a mix of MEK and Barge cement. However, the formula of both Barge and Pliobond has changed in the last few years in order the protect us from ourselves and the environment from us. Some experimentation may be in order.
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Re: TT Trackwork

Postby richardedmonds » Tue Oct 21, 2014 6:08 pm

Has anybody that you know experimented with cast resin sleepers/ties at all and does anybody have any opinions as to using resin as opposed to wooden sleepers
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Re: TT Trackwork

Postby Tom Dempsey » Tue Oct 21, 2014 6:27 pm

I don't know of anyone who has used resin ties. I can tell you that the cost of resin ties cast for you as opposed to wood ties cut for you would be cost prohibitive. If you make your own master and cast your own mold and ties, perhaps the cost would come down. Not knowing what the cost of wood ties on your side of the pond is, I can't tell for sure. I do suspect that the resin ties would still work out to be more expensive, and probably noisier. However, I also do have a dog in this fight so "Your mileage may vary" as regards my opinion on this question.
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Re: TT Trackwork

Postby richardedmonds » Tue Oct 21, 2014 6:30 pm

krokodil wrote:The Kuehn itself is already quite critical with its rail height of about 1.7 mm. Only the newest rolling stock works well on this track. To reduce the rail height will require finer wheels on every vehicle. Into Tillig sleepers we pulled already different rails - the critical is the footsize of the rail material. We experimented with Code55 rails but the original fittings were to hight so finally we glued the rails to the flat sleepers.


Yes this is the problem for me, firstly I thought of kuehn then I saw the turnouts which i did not like at all. Then Mark came up with the Sazmodel no6 with code 55 and that was the green light to handlaying some fine scale track and having some fun doing so. However in reality I might need to back off slightly from the ultra fine scale using tieplates etc purely because of the awkwardness of the tiny parts. However I am still commited to code 55 as a standard and I think i could get code 55 to work in a kuehn trackbase with a bit of effort but need to get some decent gauges to check.
Incidentaly the keuhn trackbase is pretty much spot on with a "Virginian" track drawing i have so we shall see
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Re: TT Trackwork

Postby richardedmonds » Tue Oct 21, 2014 6:37 pm

Tom Dempsey wrote:I don't know of anyone who has used resin ties. I can tell you that the cost of resin ties cast for you as opposed to wood ties cut for you would be cost prohibitive. If you make your own master and cast your own mold and ties, perhaps the cost would come down. Not knowing what the cost of wood ties on your side of the pond is, I can't tell for sure. I do suspect that the resin ties would still work out to be more expensive, and probably noisier. However, I also do have a dog in this fight so "Your mileage may vary" as regards my opinion on this question.


Yes Tom I understand that but all turnouts etc will still be wood and copper board and handlaid and nobody over here does American sized ties in wood
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Re: TT Trackwork

Postby sd80mac » Wed Oct 22, 2014 12:53 am

Tom Dempsey wrote:I don't know of anyone who has used resin ties. I can tell you that the cost of resin ties cast for you as opposed to wood ties cut for you would be cost prohibitive. If you make your own master and cast your own mold and ties, perhaps the cost would come down. Not knowing what the cost of wood ties on your side of the pond is, I can't tell for sure. I do suspect that the resin ties would still work out to be more expensive, and probably noisier. However, I also do have a dog in this fight so "Your mileage may vary" as regards my opinion on this question.


Here's a rough break-down of conventional track laying materials:

Clover House standard length wood ties cost $1.08/ft.
Clover House Turnout length wood ties cost $2.17/ft.
Micro Engineering Code 55 Rail cost $0.98/ft

So, you can hand-lay TT track using store bought materials for between $2-$3 per foot.

Fast Tracks sells its HO-scale laser-cut TwistTies in 10" lengths for $4.41. That's a staggering $26 for just 5 feet of track without rail! You could probably find someone to laser-cut some TT ties for much less. In fact, weren't Bernd and Brian talking about making track in another thread? Bernd showed some samples of Taskboard ties and an aluminum master for making a resin tie strip.

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Re: TT Trackwork

Postby krokodil » Wed Oct 22, 2014 12:59 am

image.jpg
Handlaid TT
richardedmonds wrote:
krokodil wrote:The Kuehn itself is already quite critical with its rail height of about 1.7 mm. Only the newest rolling stock works well on this track. To reduce the rail height will require finer wheels on every vehicle. Into Tillig sleepers we pulled already different rails - the critical is the footsize of the rail material. We experimented with Code55 rails but the original fittings were to hight so finally we glued the rails to the flat sleepers.


Yes this is the problem for me, firstly I thought of kuehn then I saw the turnouts which i did not like at all. Then Mark came up with the Sazmodel no6 with code 55 and that was the green light to handlaying some fine scale track and having some fun doing so. However in reality I might need to back off slightly from the ultra fine scale using tieplates etc purely because of the awkwardness of the tiny parts. However I am still commited to code 55 as a standard and I think i could get code 55 to work in a kuehn trackbase with a bit of effort but need to get some decent gauges to check.
Incidentaly the keuhn trackbase is pretty much spot on with a "Virginian" track drawing i have so we shall see


Hi, the main challenge is not the handlaying, relatively easy to decide and to make, but the decision for the wheel flanges is much more critical. Especially if you have already some vehicles. Here are my last handmade turnouts, finally I selected the higher rails to be sure that all my vehicles will work.
You can try eventually the trick used by PECO, inside of the rails the ties are lower giving enough space for the flanges. It requires special ties or rails. ( inside hight will be cca 1.8 mm, outside can be less than code 55).
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Re: TT Trackwork

Postby richardedmonds » Wed Oct 22, 2014 2:56 pm

"krokodil"

That handlaid track photo is what I am getting at, that looks superb and completely non-toy like thats why I want to pursue the code 55 rail. The smaller the rails the better it looks to me even if I have to change wheels on everything
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