Trams

Trams

Postby Arseny » Mon Jan 21, 2013 5:53 am

I've discovered that some old New York trams are available in TT!

http://modelytramvaji.websnadno.cz/TT-- ... fSale.html
(marked as New York / Wien typ Z)

In 1948, Vienna acquired second hand trams of Type Z (road numbers 4201-4242) under the Marshall Plan from New York. These trams became known as Amerikaner.
They were from the Third Avenue Railway System (TARS).

The Third Avenue Railway System (TARS) was a street railroad system in New York City in the 19th and early 20th century.
The main line was in Park Row, Bowery, and Third Avenue in Manhattan but the Third Avenue companies controlled others with routes in Manhattan and the Bronx and outside the city in Westchester County

Due to a ban on overhead trolley wires in Manhattan, streetcars collected power from a conduit in between the rails. Some cars were equipped with trolley poles for operation on lines outside Manhattan into the Bronx.

Streetcars had a rocky history in New York City going into the 1930s. Mayor Fiorello LaGuardia did not feel that trolleys were agreeable to the modern image he was trying to portray. Operating franchises for trolleys were not renewed, leaving TARS with no choice but to convert to bus operation. By 1942, TARS subsidiary Surface Transportation System was operating one of the world's largest fleets of diesel-powered buses.

At one point, TARS operated trolleys as far north as the city of White Plains, some 20 miles north of New York City. With weak and declining ridership, the White Plains lines shut down by the end of the 1920s, converted to bus operation. All lines in Manhattan and the Bronx were converted to bus by 1948. Trolley routes in Mount Vernon and New Rochelle were converted by the end of 1950. Trolley operations in Westchester County lasted until 1952, when the last of the Yonkers routes were shut down that October.

After the system's abandonment, 42 cars of the largest and newest type, built by TARS itself in 1938–1939 (on Brill trucks), were sold to the operator of the Vienna, Austria, streetcar system, Wiener Stadtwerke Verkehrsbetriebe (now Wiener Linien), for operation there. They were renumbered, designated Vienna type "Z" and fitted with pantographs in place of their trolley poles. They did not use conduit current collection in Vienna. They entered service there in 1949–1950 and were retired in 1969 when track brakes became mandatory

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Avenue_Railway

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trams_in_Vienna

http://modelytramvaji.websnadno.cz/TT-- ... fSale.html
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Re: Trams

Postby LVG1 » Mon Jan 21, 2013 3:09 pm

Very interesting story! :thumbup:

I also like streetcars.
But for operation on a model railroad layout, those with pantographs are more practical than trolleys. :problem:
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Re: Trams

Postby Arseny » Mon Jan 21, 2013 3:19 pm

I am afraid that they both will be fictitious, fake in any case. ;)
It's too hard to build operational catenary on the layout.
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Re: Trams

Postby LVG1 » Mon Jan 21, 2013 3:33 pm

You are right.
But does catenary on a model railroad layout have to be operational? It should look like operational, but in my eyes it doesn't have to be.

On a moving model it's easier to keep a pantograph in position than a trolley pole. That's why I prefer pantographs.
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Re: Trams

Postby Arseny » Mon Jan 21, 2013 3:38 pm

As for me, I prefer ...steam locomotives. :wink:

But I like exotic things. It's quite unusual for European resident (we, Russians, are the part of Europe, aren't we? :wink: ) to see the trolley poles on the tram.
So it's very interesting for me.

P.S. As for me, I am afraid I will not build the layout with the streetcars, but maybe somebody will do it?
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Re: Trams

Postby j p » Mon Jan 21, 2013 3:56 pm

Arseny wrote:As for me, I prefer ...steam locomotives. :wink:

But I like exotic things. It's quite unusual for European resident (we, Russians, are the part of Europe, aren't we? :wink: ) to see the trolley poles on the tram.
So it's very interesting for me.

P.S. As for me, I am afraid I will not build the layout with the streetcars, but maybe somebody will do it?


Oh really?
Have you ever been to Riga? That is not too far from your city. But you have to hurry up, they started to change their system to pantographs after delivery of their newest trams from Czech.
http://www.google.com/search?q=riga+tram&hl=da&tbo=d&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=0pv9UJCRI83Esgb4u4HYAQ&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAA&biw=1253&bih=789
Last edited by Anonymous on Mon Jan 21, 2013 3:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Trams

Postby LVG1 » Mon Jan 21, 2013 3:57 pm

Arseny wrote:It's quite unusual for European resident (we, Russians, are the part of Europe, aren't we? :wink: ) to see the trolley poles on the tram.


I thought, there are so many trolley bus operators in Russia. So trolley poles should be a familiar sight for you... :wink:
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Re: Trams

Postby LVG1 » Mon Jan 21, 2013 3:59 pm

j p wrote:Have you ever been to Riga? That is not too far from your city. But you have to hurry up, they started to change their system to pantographs after delivery of their newest trams from Czech.
http://www.google.com/search?q=riga+tram&hl=da&tbo=d&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=0pv9UJCRI83Esgb4u4HYAQ&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAA&biw=1253&bih=789


That's what I really didn't know. :shock:
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Re: Trams

Postby Arseny » Tue Jan 22, 2013 2:49 am

j p wrote:
Arseny wrote:As for me, I prefer ...steam locomotives. :wink:

But I like exotic things. It's quite unusual for European resident (we, Russians, are the part of Europe, aren't we? :wink: ) to see the trolley poles on the tram.
So it's very interesting for me.

P.S. As for me, I am afraid I will not build the layout with the streetcars, but maybe somebody will do it?


Oh really?
Have you ever been to Riga? That is not too far from your city. But you have to hurry up, they started to change their system to pantographs after delivery of their newest trams from Czech.
http://www.google.com/search?q=riga+tram&hl=da&tbo=d&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=0pv9UJCRI83Esgb4u4HYAQ&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAA&biw=1253&bih=789


Did not know about it. It's funny.
I've visited Riga sometime ago, in 1980s, but I did not notice their trams...

LVG1 wrote:
Arseny wrote:It's quite unusual for European resident (we, Russians, are the part of Europe, aren't we? :wink: ) to see the trolley poles on the tram.


I thought, there are so many trolley bus operators in Russia. So trolley poles should be a familiar sight for you... :wink:


Of course, there are a lot of trolleybuses here. But trolleybuses, not trams!
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Re: Trams

Postby Arseny » Tue Jan 22, 2013 3:09 am

Arseny wrote:In 1948, Vienna acquired second hand trams ... from New York.


trolly.jpg
Park Row and Broadway, Manhattan. 1938
Lijn2171955.jpg
on Vienna tram line 217 in the 1950s.
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