Motor bogies?

Motor bogies?

Postby scaro » Mon Jul 19, 2010 4:11 pm

Thinking a bit how to power a loco using the BR130 trucks. I thought a Mashima 916 motor could fit between the trucks, eliminating messy shaft and gear alterations if you wanted to shorten or lengthen the chassis. And on most locos, a Mashima would fit. But there's not even the 16mm needed clearance needed between the trucks of the loco I want to do. A little cousin of the Alco RSD7, so it's all feet . . .

http://www.johnnyspages.com/locos_files/40_loco841.jpg

A Nigel Lawton 6v micro motor (with resistor) can be fit into the integral shaft in each truck, sitting above the dummy axle and so creating a motor bogie. Then it does not matter which way around the truck goes, so for the unit I'm looking at, the trucks could be fitted in reverse; the dummy inner axle becomes an outer axle and its spacing can be adjusted a little. An option for anyone wanting to build an RSD4 or any of the Alcos,GEs etc with asymmetrical trucks.

Has anyone used these motors? Only 6mm x 10mm and very tough -they have become legendary in the UK as they can fit where no other motor will, but still haul a decent load.

Integral motor bogies may be worth considering in TT, as getting the right axle centres /pivot points is a headache, not to mentioning trying to fit Euro carbody chassis into narrow American hoods.

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Re: Motor bogies?

Postby TinGoat » Tue Aug 31, 2010 2:36 pm

Hey,

This looks like a good idea!

One thought that comes to mind is using two [,three or more] of these tiny motors that all feed into a single gearbox and then through a reduction and worm gear to the wheels...

Two small motors might fit where one big one won't...

Using two of these motors in series would eliminate the need for the resistor to bring the voltage down from 12VDC to 6VDC

Nigel Lawton has a few mini and micro motors to choose from: http://www.nigellawton009.com/VeeTipper.html
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Re: Motor bogies?

Postby ConducTTor » Tue Aug 31, 2010 3:00 pm

This is an interesting proposition. However, what if any is the chance of one motor being slightly faster/slower than the other - requiring one of them to always have to pull the other one along?
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Re: Motor bogies?

Postby TinGoat » Tue Aug 31, 2010 3:16 pm

ConducTTor wrote:This is an interesting proposition. However, what if any is the chance of one motor being slightly faster/slower than the other - requiring one of them to always have to pull the other one along?


Good question....

I don't really know the answer but using multiple traction motors in 1:1 scale are the norm. :grin:

The benefit, as I see it, is two-fold.

    Stacking a pair of small motors will fit in a narrow hood easier than one big motor.
    If one motor stalls, the other one will nudge it back into motion, sort of like the flywheel effect

Perhaps using a belt drive instead of gears would act as a bit of a cushion between two slightly mis-matched motors.

A couple of other things come to mind.

The old Bachmann HO 44-tonner used two motors. [one on each truck]

These old 44-tonners are coveted by the On30 critter builders for power units.
Image

The other thing that comes to mind is perhaps using Pancake Motors instead of Cans.

ModelTorque has a re-motor kit for old Lima Locomotives that uses a Pancake:
http://www.modeltorque.com.au/Lima.htm

I've also seen people use Pancake motors from CD-ROM drives.

With the right reduction gearing, a Pancake is a viable option...
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Re: Motor bogies?

Postby TinGoat » Tue Aug 31, 2010 3:29 pm

And... Another thing....

There's nothing wrong with Open Frame Motors! They take up less space than Can Motors...
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Re: Motor bogies?

Postby AstroGoat760 » Tue Aug 31, 2010 4:43 pm

A horizontal shaft bogie, like that used on some Lionel F-3s back in the 1950's would work out quite well for narrow hood locomotives such as the ALCO RS-3.

How much do those micro motors cost? Those tiny motors are normally quite costly, so the prospect of using 4 of those in a TT scale diesel is likely going to be expensive as heck.
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Re: Motor bogies?

Postby TinGoat » Tue Aug 31, 2010 6:01 pm

The Micro Motors are $12.00USD each, plus shipping...
http://www.nigellawton009.com/PayPalMotors.html

Plus shipping and handling.

There are options between Gear, Pulley/Belt and Friction drives. It wouldn't be too difficult to cobble something together with all these bits and pieces.
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Re: Motor bogies?

Postby ConducTTor » Tue Aug 31, 2010 6:35 pm

Interesting site. It would be nice if they also made/sold various flywheels but the root pulleys can be used for that purpose.
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Re: Motor bogies?

Postby TinGoat » Tue Aug 31, 2010 7:33 pm

At this point there is a bit of a cross-over between this thread and the EMD SD45 thread:
http://www.ttnut.com/building-emd-sd45-t182-90.html#p6946

Perhaps N-Scale flywheels could be employed...

Two motors were used [one on each bogie] in the Bachmann 44-tonner.

The same two motor set-up is frequently used in O-Scale and G-Scale locomotives.

One thing that strikes me about the Hollywood Foundry mechanisms is that the motors are always mounted horizontally.

A micro motor that is mounted vertically on each bogie might be an option.

Also, as an alternative to flywheels.... Switch from Worm/Spur Gears to Bevel Gears. Then the momentum of the locomotive with be self perpetuating.
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Re: Motor bogies?

Postby CSD » Tue Aug 31, 2010 10:35 pm

Just an opinion, folks. I don't think you need to get too hung up on what will fit. If I can get a Machima motor and Tillig gear towers into my T435 project (total space 80 mm x 12 mm x 20 mm) and still fit in 3 LED's on each end, a circuit board, digital decoder and maintain an open cab, you can get those parts into the SD45 or any other similar project. Norkin's SD45 is super easy as he is suppling the frame. Just a note about the V120: The gear towers are not centered on the truck but are between the outside two axles as only they are powered.
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