HP Catalogue 1948

Re: HP Catalogue 1948

Postby CaTTwoman281 » Mon Jan 13, 2014 1:46 pm

If memory serves, there was a 1947 catalog that had a number of early production photos, and seemed to emphasize their E-7 locos, with a NYC E-7 being shown. Then again, I may be wrong on the year.
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Re: HP Catalogue 1948

Postby areibel » Mon Jan 13, 2014 3:13 pm

j p wrote:The problems you describe might be caused by forgetting to glue it?

Anyway, if anyone is interested in the ripple tie base sections for HP track, let me know. I have an extra box of it.


I've tried it every way you can think of, I wanted to build a period correct TT layout and gave up after several attempts. A couple of old timers laughed at me when I told them what I wanted to do, they said the rail didn't hold in the grooves after a (short) while.. On the ripple base the only slight success I had was putting a dab of ACC on the base after the rail was in place, that would hold for a while but would eventually give way and the rail would come loose. Not sure if it's because I was trying to use 50+ year old stuff and it had dried out or what, but I can see a bunch of frustrated TT'ers back in the old days! I talked to Larry Sayre about it more than once, he thought one of the big failures in TT was there wasn't any sectional track available in those days. You had to build a layout and spike the rail to get it to work right, the HO stuff could be put together and taken apart until a layout was built. Some was better than others, there was a company called Peare Engineering that built some sturdy flex track with fiber ties and switches later on but they used Code 100 rail for everything (the same size as their HO offerings).
The wood road base was much better, I would run a pizza cutter wheel down through the slots and tap the rail into the slots with a wooden mallet. When you ballasted it I think the moisture helped expand the wood and hold the rail, I have some I did probably 12 years ago on my display shelf and it's held up nicely, but nothing really runs over it. And finding a quantity of it to build a layout was a problem, John Harmon had a good idea to reproduce the wood pieces in resin but you'd still need to find enough ribbon rail and switches to do it. Tillig and Kruger made life much easier!
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Re: HP Catalogue 1948

Postby CaTTwoman281 » Mon Jan 13, 2014 3:22 pm

areibel wrote:
j p wrote:The problems you describe might be caused by forgetting to glue it?

Anyway, if anyone is interested in the ripple tie base sections for HP track, let me know. I have an extra box of it.


I've tried it every way you can think of, I wanted to build a period correct TT layout and gave up after several attempts. A couple of old timers laughed at me when I told them what I wanted to do, they said the rail didn't hold in the grooves after a (short) while.. On the ripple base the only slight success I had was putting a dab of ACC on the base after the rail was in place, that would hold for a while but would eventually give way and the rail would come loose. Not sure if it's because I was trying to use 50+ year old stuff and it had dried out or what, but I can see a bunch of frustrated TT'ers back in the old days! I talked to Larry Sayre about it more than once, he thought one of the big failures in TT was there wasn't any sectional track available in those days. You had to build a layout and spike the rail to get it to work right, the HO stuff could be put together and taken apart until a layout was built. Some was better than others, there was a company called Peare Engineering that built some sturdy flex track with fiber ties and switches later on but they used Code 100 rail for everything (the same size as their HO offerings).
The wood road base was much better, I would run a pizza cutter wheel down through the slots and tap the rail into the slots with a wooden mallet. When you ballasted it I think the moisture helped expand the wood and hold the rail, I have some I did probably 12 years ago on my display shelf and it's held up nicely, but nothing really runs over it. And finding a quantity of it to build a layout was a problem, John Harmon had a good idea to reproduce the wood pieces in resin but you'd still need to find enough ribbon rail and switches to do it. Tillig and Kruger made life much easier!


My husband tried to use some N scale rails on a test section of that HP roadbed to use for his workbench. I do not think I have ever seen him so mad at one of his projects before or since. The rest of our HP base sections remain in their box, and will likely remain as such for the rest of their existence.
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Re: HP Catalogue 1948

Postby j p » Mon Jan 13, 2014 3:41 pm

Those few HP turnouts I have in the ripple base just hold without any problems. When looking closer on the bottom, there are some marks on the underside of the profile, so the profile is wider there and cannot get lose.
I'll take a picture.
I also prefer the wood road base.
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Re: HP Catalogue 1948

Postby milwrd1 » Mon Jan 13, 2014 7:41 pm

CaTTwoman281 wrote:If memory serves, there was a 1947 catalog that had a number of early production photos, and seemed to emphasize their E-7 locos, with a NYC E-7 being shown. Then again, I may be wrong on the year.


1948 was the first integrated catalog. Prior to 1948, promotional information was provided to hobby shops and the model railroad media. Advertisements appeared in the popular magazines (Model Railroader and Railroad Model Craftsman) and parts and kits would be ordered from this material, but they were mostly sale brochures. I know I'm splitting hairs here (the promotional information could certainly be called a catalog), but the subject 1948 catalog was the first catalog.

Another reason which tells us the 1948 catalog is very early is the coupler illustration provided on page 18. Shown are the very first HP couplers, the semi automatic type, part no. 600. It would be generous to call them semi automatic. Most of the time manual intervention was required to couple or uncouple. I've only had very limited experience with these, I found them installed on several freight cars I had purchased many years ago. Some of the very, very early HP freight car kits (the kits in the brown boxes, not the more common blue boxes) had these couplers. Help was on the way, however. The December 1949 catalog lists the automatic 610 coupler, which worked rather well, but still lacked prototypical appearance. Thank god for the MTL N scale couplers :!: :!:
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Re: HP Catalogue 1948

Postby milwrd1 » Mon Jan 13, 2014 7:54 pm

areibel wrote:
You had to build a layout and spike the rail to get it to work right, the HO stuff could be put together and taken apart until a layout was built. Some was better than others, there was a company called Peare Engineering that built some sturdy flex track with fiber ties and switches later on but they used Code 100 rail for everything (the same size as their HO offerings).
Tillig and Kruger made life much easier!


Yes, the above is true. Much of the demise of TT in the United States was attributed to the lack of quality track products. Sectional track was not available (as in HO). I would not call the HP rail components sectional track. The flex track available (from Peare, Umpco(?) and I believe even Atlas at one time) was very much oversize, using code 100 rail. Switches were another problem, no manufacturer at the time seemed to have a product which was reliable and offered a scale appearance.

Al is correct....the track components offered by Tillig and Kruger and others has made life much easier.
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Re: HP Catalogue 1948 shape, size

Postby D Martin » Mon Jun 16, 2014 10:42 am

Hello, all. I note I am very late about posting a reply in this thread. The HP 1948 catalog was to be stapled together about 3-1/2 inches from one end of the paper, then folded to make 3-1/2 by 11 inch packet. This is a common folded shape using ordinary 8-1/2 by 11 inch paper. When folded this way, it fits into a common number ten business envelope, which is 9-1/2 by 4-1/8 inches. So, I think HP made the catalog to fit the popular business size envelope, but were not trying to be artistic.

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Re: HP Catalogue 1948

Postby j p » Mon Jun 16, 2014 11:13 am

I have a different question: does anyone have a 1946 catalogue? I was told that one of the models I bought some time ago was shown only in that catalogue. I would like to get it confirmed :wink:
It would help me to get the history of that one early-TT engine correct.
Please pm if you can help in this. Thank you!
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Re: HP Catalogue 1948

Postby areibel » Mon Jun 16, 2014 10:26 pm

There wasn't a real catalog until 1948, like Milwrd1 has said in an earlier post. According to Larry Sayre there were a some papers that were sent around to hobby shops showing the line, about the same time the ads started appearing in MR and RMC but the first catalog is the one Rob has posted here. What is the special model you have? From the research I've done the only locomotive model that was made but isn't shown in a catalog were the early 2-8-8-2's with the small drivers.
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Re: HP Catalogue 1948

Postby Arseny » Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:20 am

I have Model Railroader October 1946 issue, with first TT scale advertising.

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