"Certification" guidelines discussion

Re: "Certification" guidelines discussion

Postby Bernd » Wed Oct 07, 2015 6:02 pm

You want certification? There are three leading railroad magazines out there that will evaluate your product, Railroad Model Craftsman, Model Railroader, and Model Railroad Hobbyist. Send an item to them for evaluation in their product review section of the magazine. I think some of the European Manufacturers are afraid to send anything to them for fear they'll get a bad review.

I also have to agree with Al. Just make some models and get them to the general model railroad public just like Irv Athearn did with his product line. The newer modelers have never heard of TT. How do I know. I've talked to many at local shows. A majority have no idea TT was ever a scale.

Bernd
Image
User avatar
Bernd
 
Posts: 837
Images: 27
Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2015 8:43 am
Location: Rochester, New York

Re: "Certification" guidelines discussion

Postby j p » Wed Oct 07, 2015 6:12 pm

Tom, as it looks at the moment, the "business case" is wrong.
Making the artwork is not for free, even when copying and rescaling someone else' artwork.
If I wanted to use your artwork, I would ask for a permission and you would get your license fee.
Why? If I bought your O-scale decal/transfer set, scanned it, converted to vectors, cleaned up the errors, and then re-scaled to TT, the cost for me would be more than sales of TT-scale version of your decals or transfers for decades. Not mentioning the bad reputation.
Therefore, I would be happy to make a license agreement with you. It is definitely worth to avoid the bad taste in the mouth (and save my time).

(Sadly, I have enough experience with the "bad taste in my mouth", caused not by any cottage industry, but one of the biggest players on the market. That was not in model railroading though.)
j p
 
Posts: 1199
Images: 69
Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2016 5:08 pm

Re: "Certification" guidelines discussion

Postby ConducTTor » Wed Oct 07, 2015 7:37 pm

So, this whole thing has derailed. Does anyone have a good reason for the topic to continue?
What people think: "liberals/conservatives are ruining my country"
What the powerful know: divide and conquer
User avatar
ConducTTor
Site Admin
 
Posts: 8293
Images: 13
Joined: Sat May 23, 2009 4:52 pm
Location: Atlanta GA USA

Re: "Certification" guidelines discussion

Postby Tom Dempsey » Wed Oct 07, 2015 8:33 pm

Well, if you are asking that question Alex, I believe you already have the answer.
Tom Dempsey
 
Posts: 245
Images: 1
Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 9:08 pm

Re: "Certification" guidelines discussion

Postby Marquette » Wed Oct 07, 2015 9:00 pm

Well, digressions and all I think this can be a worthwhile discussion, since good can come out of any discourse, but the primary question I think is - is there any need for the subject of this topic?

It's an interesting idea, but in the end it would be, I think, entirely up to the manufacturers whether they want to get this "certification" or not - and what real incentive would there be for them to want it? Again, I think it is an interesting idea, but I think the best that could come of it would be, perhaps, as a standard (or RP) for new product reviews here on TT Nut, with a view to ensuring those reviews are as objective as possible...
http://espeett.blogspot.com - The SP in 1:120 - my attempt at a blog
#include <std/disclaimer.h>
User avatar
Marquette
 
Posts: 2061
Joined: Wed Dec 23, 2009 8:16 pm

Re: "Certification" guidelines discussion

Postby ConducTTor » Wed Oct 07, 2015 9:18 pm

I'm starting to think we bit off more than we can chew. Here is a very small part of what I think is a mountain to overcome. Take a basic thing like measurements. Anyone can grab calipers and measure. However, there is no single model on earth that is an EXACT scale representation of the real thing. So how much tolerance is ok? Is it ok to be off by 10%? How about 7%? 5%? Maybe some things are ok being 6% off. Maybe some others need to be within 2%. Who gets to make those decisions? Who decides what's ok in this case that will be applied to absolutely everything? I can see 10 pages of argument on this most subjective criteria alone. And I'm sure that at the end of the 10 pages, 90% of the people will be unhappy about the outcome. And when it comes to paint? Well, that seems to me is an argument with no end - just take a look at any topic on any forum about paint.
What people think: "liberals/conservatives are ruining my country"
What the powerful know: divide and conquer
User avatar
ConducTTor
Site Admin
 
Posts: 8293
Images: 13
Joined: Sat May 23, 2009 4:52 pm
Location: Atlanta GA USA

Re: "Certification" guidelines discussion

Postby j p » Thu Oct 08, 2015 1:53 am

ConducTTor wrote:I'm starting to think we bit off more than we can chew. Here is a very small part of what I think is a mountain to overcome. Take a basic thing like measurements. Anyone can grab calipers and measure. However, there is no single model on earth that is an EXACT scale representation of the real thing. So how much tolerance is ok? Is it ok to be off by 10%? How about 7%? 5%? Maybe some things are ok being 6% off. Maybe some others need to be within 2%. Who gets to make those decisions? Who decides what's ok in this case that will be applied to absolutely everything? I can see 10 pages of argument on this most subjective criteria alone. And I'm sure that at the end of the 10 pages, 90% of the people will be unhappy about the outcome. And when it comes to paint? Well, that seems to me is an argument with no end - just take a look at any topic on any forum about paint.


That is why you'd have a scale from 1 to 10. The reviewer indicates how much it is off, not what is supposed to be OK for you :) Scale representation is objective. The decision whether 5%,10% or 20% of is OK would be left to you. Paint is subjective, and therefore, more reviewers were suggested.
And no, Alex. Not anyone can take calipers and measure. Because you have to buy the model/kit first to be able to measure. And that is too late. There are some excellent models, some average models and then something I'd not call a scale model. It is the same in EU TT, with the difference that the community is larger and you get warned against scam.
If I pay 100 dollars for a model (incl. shipment and taxes), I prefer to spend it on a good model, to support a good manufacturer and to be happy with it.
j p
 
Posts: 1199
Images: 69
Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2016 5:08 pm

Re: "Certification" guidelines discussion

Postby rdikken » Thu Oct 08, 2015 3:32 am

Perhaps a suggestion:

Take two or three examples. Perhaps Marquette and I can do this. Take some model related characteristics and some livery related characteristics, perhaps an existing car number is also one.

With these examples start again the discussion with two questions:
- is there a benefit for the US TT fan
- does this lead to better models in the end

Again, it should act as a reward for the manufacturer to make better models.

As an model initiator, taken the financial risc of making models, I will do my part to achieve as much as possible correct models and livery characteristics. It would already be a benefit if we have them on paper.

Rob
rdikken
 
Posts: 177
Joined: Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:10 pm
Location: Smilde, The Netherlands

Re: "Certification" guidelines discussion

Postby ConducTTor » Thu Oct 08, 2015 1:05 pm

I've gotten an incredible amount of negative comments regarding this topic. This idea is either not good or simply too divisive. For the sake of the community as a whole, I'm locking this.
What people think: "liberals/conservatives are ruining my country"
What the powerful know: divide and conquer
User avatar
ConducTTor
Site Admin
 
Posts: 8293
Images: 13
Joined: Sat May 23, 2009 4:52 pm
Location: Atlanta GA USA

Previous

Return to General Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests