Anyone in/near Sacramento, or...

Anyone in/near Sacramento, or...

Postby Marquette » Thu May 22, 2014 3:40 pm

Is anyone near the California State Library in Sacramento, or near a university in California with a good map library?

If so, and if you'd be willing to give me an assist with something, could you let me know so I can PM you?

Thanks! :)
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Re: Anyone in/near Sacramento, or...

Postby Shipsure » Fri May 23, 2014 10:30 am

I am down there about once a month...what are you looking for?

Joe
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Re: Anyone in/near Sacramento, or...

Postby Richard-B » Fri May 23, 2014 12:48 pm

Sac-a-tomatos is an hour north...
UC Berzerkly - Bancroft library 15 minutes...
Stanford University - 35 minutes.. I'm scheduled for a CESTA meeting there Thursday.
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Somewhere between Shenzhen and Budapest...
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Re: Anyone in/near Sacramento, or...

Postby Shipsure » Fri May 23, 2014 2:39 pm

much better solution :)
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Re: Anyone in/near Sacramento, or...

Postby Marquette » Fri May 23, 2014 9:35 pm

What I'm looking for is Sanborn maps - of Carpinteria, Summerland and Montecito.
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Re: Anyone in/near Sacramento, or...

Postby Shipsure » Sat May 24, 2014 3:21 am

I doubt they will have any of those maps in those locations. You can go on line and register for Sanborn down load service or order hard copies. Here is what's on Carpinteria....http://www.loc.gov/rr/geogmap/sanborn/city.php?CITY=Carpinteria&stateID=5 and http://www.loc.gov/rr/geogmap/sanborn/city.php?CITY=Montebello&stateID=5 I emailed to request costs for my own project and waiting for how to order and what pricing levels they have. You can get the same maps through the Library of Congress, probably for just shipping charges..http://catalog.loc.gov/vwebv/search?searchArg=Carpinteria%20%28Calif.%29--Maps.&searchCode=SUBJ%2B&searchType=1&recCount=100

This might get you started... Image

Here is the area around the depot. Image

These folks are very helpful.. http://www.carpinteriahistoricalmuseum.org/

Here are some important industries to consider.. Johnston Fruit Company
Union Oil
Standard Oil
Carpinteria Mutual Lemon
Henry Fish Bean Company
Santa Claus Lane
Carpinteria Lemon Association

Here are the scales near the Lemon Association building. Image and map Image Image Image

Early for what you are modeling, but you get some flavor here : http://www.decomposingsb.com/?cat=18

A little bit south, but lots of good information about the area and what the architecture looks like. http://coastdaylight.com/ljames1/scph_ventura.html


Also you asked about the type 17 style depot...The one that was in Carpinteria is the mirror image of the station in Santa Paula...one of the main physical differences between the 22 and the 17 is the style of roof and the apron roof above the first floor. The ticket window is also a different shape. I have these :grin: [url]coastdaylight.com/ljames1/scph_ventura.html[/url] and this is what it looks like http://www.flickr.com/photos/sethgaines/2645314939/

This is a painting of the Carpenteria station...in my Signor Book they have a photo of the station. Image

I did a quick search of the California State Railroad Museum and nothing comes back. I had the same problem researching Surf...but with some extra digging came up with site plot, and drawings of the depot. There could be more there...contact them via email and they can do a more extensive search for you. Another on line service is the Getty Museum...they have millions of vintage photos from all over the place. I was able to use them to get photo's in Surf around the early 1960 from a robbery that took place there. Lots of overall shots that filled in the missing info I was looking for.

Well, that's all I have at the moment...contact the SB historical society...I bet they have tons of area shots.

Cheers

Joe
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Re: Anyone in/near Sacramento, or...

Postby Shipsure » Sat May 24, 2014 3:25 am

http://www.historicaerials.com/aerials.php?scale=2000&lon=-119.50330352783&lat=34.389789581299&year=2005One more...there are a number of historical Aerial photo sites that may get you some cool imagery for specific years. You can also use google earth of course and be able to spot some landmarks. Again, in researching Surf I was able to get an image of the area...tracks are still there but the depot is gone as is the small town around it. All that's left is a passenger shelter and a plaque :( But, with that photo I was able to see the run out and the unique turning Wye just to the north...probable the most interesting part of the area really. http://www.historicaerials.com/aerials.php?scale=2000&lon=-120.59622192383&lat=34.68595123291&year=2005

Joe :thumbup:
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Re: Anyone in/near Sacramento, or...

Postby Marquette » Sat May 24, 2014 5:32 am

Thanks for all that, Joe!

The libraries, however, do all have the Sanborns for those places (any pretty well everywhere in CA), either on microfilm or on paper. I doubt it's changed since I last looked some years ago but the pricing was pretty ridiculous, and most university holdings are restricted to in-person visitors and/or registered students/faculty...

I've got the two scanned parts of the Carp Sanborns, but would be nice to have complete sheets as well as the other relevant sheets. The third one (#153 in the corner) is actually Santa Barbara.

If you look at those two of Carp... the station was gone in the 70s, and when I lived half-years in Carp in the 80s it was just a big gravel field... there was an apartment building at the (left-side) corner of 5th and Elm (mum lived there for the first few years); later she moved into a mobile home in the park which is at Holly between 4th and Dorrance... it'd be interesting to know when the mobile home park was put in. What timing, though, I haven't been back to Carp since 1994... in 1997 they opened a new passenger platform and trains stop there again. I could take the train from Vancouver to Carpinteria... one day I will. I suspect that's a gorgeous trip!

The scale house looks super nifty - do you happen to have any info on the location? From my memory it doesn't fit with Carp, the location of the building on the background and the way the track is arranged there... the rail line was/is not far from the beach so hm, I wonder if that is in SB actually and not Carp?

I e-mailed the Carpinteria Historical Museum a couple days ago, still waiting for a response. I remember visiting there a couple of times as a kid but not being particularly enthused back then... would have been if I'd have known they have photo collections, though!

I'm intending to buy Hayes' SP Depots In California volume 2 which covers the LA division, including the Ventura Sub and including Carp, Montecito and Summerland, hopefully I'll be able to order that next week. Looking forward to getting that... damn... thinking this much lately about it makes me miss California!
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Re: Anyone in/near Sacramento, or...

Postby Shipsure » Sat May 24, 2014 1:15 pm

Howdy,

Yep, most museums and libraries have access to them, but even the reproduction costs can be crazy. Too bad really. The scale house can be located on the color map I included...you can see it in proximity to the beach and the packing houses. As for it's location now...google earth, again might give you a clue if the tracks are still there. I know most packing house in this part of the country are almost never torn down because their construction is so solid. Now you got me thinking about doing Surf again...drat!

Joe
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Re: Anyone in/near Sacramento, or...

Postby Marquette » Sat May 24, 2014 4:47 pm

Doh... not quite sure how I missed that! I probably saw "Santa Barbara" on the map there and just glossed over it... for the time being I'm aiming fairly low with this idea, I'm wanting for now just to stick with Carp, Summerland and Montecito as "actually represented" spots on a potential layout; there would also be two staging yards, one after Montecito representing Santa Barbara and points north, and one after Carpinteria representing Ventura, LA and points south. As ever I'm envisioning this as a modular concept so as to make future expansion easy.

I had a very good (and necessary!) conversation with a friend the other day, which forced me to admit to myself that the likelihood of being able to model the southern Ohio location reasonably (to a standard of accuracy that will satisfy me) is, for the time being, minimal, given it would need considerably more space than I have available now or in the foreseeable future. I will continue researching it though as my "best case" plan - hopefully one day I will be able to build it. But in the meantime, I want to do something I can reasonably accomplish in current conditions. I've explored many locations, and some of them are eminently modellable - the NYC/Canada Southern St Clair Sub in southwestern Ontario; the Milwaukee branch from Sumas, WA on the Canadian border to Lynden; the Pere Marquette/C&O in Michigan's Thumb at Bad Axe or the PM's branch from Edmore to Remus, amongst others... all have been interesting but none of them really "grabbed" me in the same way this Carpinteria idea is grabbing me. Perhaps it's true what they say that childhood impressions often play a big role in determining what one ends up modelling... in any event I'm very taken by this idea and I think I am going to run with it. :)
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